EP 2 What on earth is happening with Glossier?
Sonia Elyss joins the Brand Meet Creator table to discuss what brought iconic millennial brand, Glossier to lay off 80 employees. From unclear mission to open door influencer marketing, we discuss the pivots that were made and how we can avoid their mistakes without our own personal brands.
Timestamps:
[2:20] What has Sonia been up to recently?
[3:10] What is happening with Glossier?
[5:51] What led to Glossier's downfall?
[9:16] Was their marketing not targeting consumers correctly?
[11:40] Anyone can hop online and give a viral review - what does this mean for brands and creators?
[14:32] Long term is better.
[16:41] Whoever you pick needs to be specialized in that area.
[18:40] Consistency and community is key.
--LINKS:
Find Harley:
IG: @harleyyjordann
Website: https://www.millennialescape.com/
Find Sonia:
IG: @Sonia.elyss
Website: https://www.soniaelyss.com/
Follow The Brand Meet Creator Podcast:
Rate, Review, Subscribe & Share: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/brand-meet-creator/id1609505183
00:00
Welcome to brand meet crater podcast a place where we pull back the curtain of what it means to be all in on social media. So get ready to kick start conversations about the social media world with a little leave nothing off the table transparency, or maybe more than just a little you girl has yet to learn the art of a filter. So talk in it's time to bring some solidarity to the influencer and brand space.
00:28
Today, I'm bringing on Sonia Elyss to chat about the rise and a weird fall moment of glossier, what they're doing what they did wrong, what we can do to learn from their mistakes. So let's jump in.
00:47
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01:36
Welcome Sonia leads to brand meet creator Sonia is a certified consumer marketing strategist with especially hot takes on the digital marketing space. Those beauty marketing bigwig has worked with some of the biggest brands in the industry. It Cosmetics Kiehls clarens to name a few. But let's get to why this New York girl is taking her permanent seat at the brand meet creator table. Sonia has been in an influencer marketing since the literal inception. And as 1000s of influencers millions of dollars through the campaign she ideate and facilitates. So a warm welcome to my BFF and the Internet cheerleader. Sonia Elise Sonia, please tell me what you are currently up to in the social media sphere. Thank you so much. Orly. What a great intro. I mean, I couldn't have done it better myself. What am I up to? Oh my gosh.
02:35
Different colors of euphoria themed eyeliner everyday, which live for on your stories fake you. I'm currently in a balloon mode, which I love. I'm not quite as good as the euphoria girls yet, but I'm desperately trying to be cool.
02:52
We're working on it. But yeah, right now I am focusing a lot on working with some really great new influencers over on tick tock for some of my brands, leveraging my own presence on Instagram and tick tock and just like hanging out and seeing what's going on out there these days. And there's a lot of change right now. Which is why I'm so excited to bring you on. So the reason we are hanging out for this episode is you bringing up some serious glossier tea. And as someone that knows, gusting li little about beauty things tell me what on earth
03:31
oh my gosh, well, I have to challenge that because your hair journey you know, things, you know things you're always looking right. So she knows these people. But in terms of what's going on. So if people are not aware, glossier recently announced that they were laying off a significant amount of their staff, after trying to, you know, reinvent and reinvigorate through our recent COVID crisis. They're just not coming out on the other end on top right now. And so unfortunately, they've had to let go, I believe about 80 employees was the quote, and most of those are in their tech sectors. So it was really, I think, a large blow to the beauty industry as they have been held very in high regard. Top of the pedestal, one of the brands that I hear cited the most by other brands that they would like to emulate, be like, how do they get there?
04:23
Why do brands want to be like glossier? Because they broke the mold in short, they went about it in a different way and they created a community that was so ravenous for their product that there were lions down the street in sub zero temps here in New York to get into their store. So how can which Which one, which was exactly all of them, so I used to, you know, I'm not far away from SOHO and they have a store there. Unfortunately, it's closed now. And there were always lines of ladies and gents waiting to get in for boy
05:00
eyebrow or Milky Jelly Cleanser or whatever the latest drop was going to be. And of course other brands want to know how do we build that kind of loyalty? How do we build that kind of excitement and dedication? Yeah, cult following for sure. And one of the first viral followings, I think the brand went from zero to 1 million in about four years, not a usual growth path. For people the expansion has been
05:28
not for a brand, not for a brand to know it is extremely difficult. And we're seeing more outliers, I think, especially since the launch of Tiktok and brands being on Tik Tok, where we are seeing that one to a million growth happen very, very quickly. But I will say that glossier was one of the first. Okay, so they broke the mold with what they were doing, they built this cult following, what do you think led to the downfall? Where should they have? Yeah, what do you think led to the downfall start there?
06:00
So it is definitely a multi pronged issue, right? So first and foremost, they took a very significant investment into the brand. So by taking investments from outside parties, they are now subject to creating a very high return to those parties. So how do people create a high return in a business? They have to expand very, very quickly. This meant that they lost the reins of their brand, I think a little bit they started to make decisions based off of achieving those returns instead of the what the community would really want and what had
06:43
exactly it. So instead of making those decisions based off of their why, and they're how they were making them based off of what type of investment will we get on this moving forward? What will how will this position us for global expansion, and I think they lost sight of a lot of what made them them starting out. So that would be the first place for me. Additionally, I think that they spent a lot of money building a persona and a brand that was about no makeup makeup, embracing a natural look having a natural feel, and for sure, and they were definitely the first to create a girl that other girls want it to be. Right like you saw the effortlessness of this girl who rolled out of bed, did a little bit of Boy Brow and like put on a moisturizer, and she was like gorgeous. So people wanted to be that and they built that persona up so big, that it was almost unattainable at certain points like the you just couldn't create that look with
07:49
the average skin or with the average look, you just hitting those standards. So I think that also became a little bit difficult for them. I think that that girl is URI like I because I know that that doesn't seem attainable, but like roll out of bed thing seems terrifying to me. Sure. And I think that is what happened. Like they really leaned into that. And that is definitely more of a millennial aesthetic and less of a Gen Z. aesthetic, right. So they started to see that disconnect that millennials were really so latched on to the brand and that they weren't able to reach out and get this more youthful consumer. So what did they do? They launched glossier play. And glossier play was like for the party girl, right? They started to do colorful liners, more wild looks. And they wanted to really get this more youthful consumer well in launching the sub brand that takes way more r&d, all new product range or new marketing, and it did not sell well, unfortunately, because I think it was such a left turn from where they started, that the constraints like what is this the core people who were lining up, it was not their aesthetic. And they had a track.
09:03
Exactly, they hadn't attracted enough of this new younger consumer slowly, they were trying to grab it all at once. And I think it just led to like a bit of a dissolve of the brand. They're really unfortunate. So nothing was wrong with the marketing. If you look look at the marketing itself, the Instagram, the Tick Tock their presence there. Was there anything that pivoted that just didn't make sense? Or was it to the book, it just wasn't on brand. It just wasn't that wasn't what made them sparkle. I do think that the actual assets and the actual execution was still in that cool girl aesthetic as to what made them them. Like it did still have the same tone of voice. We still saw our millennial pink, you know, it was still identified as glossier. It wasn't like so like, what is that by looking at here, but a few areas that did shift and change that I think were major issues is one
10:00
influencer marketing. So I'm sure everyone knows the Glossier code. They were one of the first people who started to reach out to influencers giving them individualized codes that they could share in exchange for affiliate partnerships. And those girls were making commission off of those sales. And I think that that partnership started really core and really niche they only onboard people who are really their typical person. And they really relied on that group of influencers. They asked them, you know, product development question, they had a group chat. And as glossier reached more virality, they started to onboard people like crazy, and they no longer became special, that you had that vote, it was no longer special that you were part of this group, you didn't have the support from the community that you did at the very beginning. So I think that was one area of marketing where they really unraveled, they lost that feeling of super tight knit community. And I do still think that they have it on Instagram, but I think that they, you know, they just lost the reins overall, I think when you grow that quickly, it's so hard to keep tight control internally and externally, you know, we hear that they had a lot of problems internally with new hires, discrimination, all sorts of issues that have popped up. And that is also a symptom of growing too quickly, not growing with intention, not hiring people who uphold your values. And we saw that reflected externally as well with the management of their influencer network, the new product launches and different things that they were doing just not really feeling like the right fit, right. So with this influencer marketing conversation with them not being selective and bringing in everyone, what what's the what's the pivot for influencer marketing in general? How can we avoid this situation, while still ensuring I guess my point of view is the creator economy, we are in the midst of it, everyone and their mother can be a creator, everyone in their mother can jump onto Instagram and create a real jump on to tick tock, tell me your wild story about a brand. Give me an honest review and have it go viral? Right, there's so many people that have gained hundreds of 1000s of followers in
12:25
that viral growth. So what does that say for creators? I don't know if that was even a question. What does that
12:32
ramble with?
12:34
It was more of a feeling.
12:38
I gave you my vibe.
12:43
Let's see, let's see if I can try to interpret into a lesson for brands and creators.
12:51
Here's where I think that you can learn from Glossier, if you are looking to build a community and an influencer program that will last one is that as you grow, it doesn't necessarily mean that like your influencer database has to grow as quickly, right? I think now, we really hold true that the depth of the partnership could be more important than the width, right? And what I mean by that is, if I'm investing in Harley as an influencer and ambassador for my brand, I might now look at her and say, What can we do over the whole course of the year? As opposed to how do I find one girl that's similar to Hartley every single month for an entire year? Right? So I think that's where glossier got it wrong. And I get why they went the method that they went, you know, it's very difficult, I will say, I mean, I definitely still look up to them as a brand, I still look to them for lessons. And I don't think that these layoffs, I mean, this is the end of the brand whatsoever. But I think that something that people can learn here is that the pivot is not more and more and more the pivot is how do I invest in people who are already on board have already been loyal? Where can I take that partnership for the long term? Because, you know, their audiences growing my audiences can grow along with them, my product offering is growing, how can they show their audience the new products so I think that there's always an opportunity to reward the people who have been with you for a longer term, as opposed to continuing to look away from the community to find new keywords. I'm just nodding my head vigorous.
14:35
I think we've been in this age of one off one off one off one off and everyone can say over and over again that long term is better long term is better find a brand that you can work with forever find a influencer that you can work with long term that's how marketing works. Who want to see your product again and again and again and know that you love it and it's your goes to. If I'm jumping between foundations every month, you're not gonna believe me
15:00
Like, Foundation is a thing that you stick to. It's not a trial. And
15:05
so it wouldn't make sense. That's my thoughts.
15:10
For sure, I mean, I think in the beauty industry, it is difficult because you do use a lot of products from a lot of different people. And you know, sometimes you mix products. And sometimes there's something new is introduced, and you want to do that. But there is a reason why some of the best content is like, what did I finish this month, there are a long laundry list
15:33
who talk about their empties, as we say, and that is so valuable. Because as someone who is I would say, an above average consumer of beauty products, get into the end of something before it gets like achy and gross, and I want to throw it out is dedication. That's dedication, that means I really love this thing. I incorporated it every single day. And I made it all the way to the end, even bigger compliment I purchased it again.
16:00
I think if you are working with someone, and this is something that I have done with some of my skincare clients before we contract for a certain amount of exposures over the lifetime of the product. So most products should be lasting you one month to three months, perhaps if you're using them every day as prescribed. So we're asking the influencer that's promoting this product to be checking in consistently over that product lifetime. That's also how you generate before and afters in skincare specifically is by saying this was me on day one when I started using it, and this is me on day 28 Or day 60 or 90. And that's how we get honest before and afters and honest review from influencers. Yeah, and that I mean, that really does drive you into exclusivity, it drives you into people that are really sticking through and through. It also drives you into a space where your person that you pick has to be specialized in that one thing, it has to be a very niche down conversation. Because if you're not that beauty creator, if you're not specialized in whatever we're talking about here, why am I going to hire you? Why am I going to know from your portfolio on your Instagram that I should hire you for seven months? Yeah, for sure. And I mean, you really have to convince people, which means that like if, let's say, you know, we don't always want to hire a skincare person every single time for skincare, of course, we want to incorporate people who have other interests. But I'm not going to hire someone who's never shown their skincare routine, I'm never going to hire someone who has never done a q&a about what they use on their face. You know, there has to be some level of consistent interest, even if it's not the number one niche for them to be even a consideration. Now, of course, it just depends on the goals of the campaign, who I'm looking for. Sometimes I am looking for specialists, who all they do is review skincare. And you know, they're really deep into the science and the ingredients. And they have a deep understanding of skincare, because they can speak to things like no one else can. But sometimes I just need someone who is relatable, who has a community that trusts them and listens, and who I know has shown up consistently talking about this subject previously. And sometimes that's enough, because then I know I have to trust that that person is able to show up every Monday and talk about like what they're using to take off their makeup or whatever else. Right. So it is about niche, but it's also about being able to identify consistency for sure. Consistency and community. Were really the drive homes there, which I mean, let's wrap it up. Taking Home is where glossier kind of fell. Yeah, I mean, it's definitely difficult to dissect all the pieces, because it does run so deep with a brand that is that large that grow that quickly. But I would say the community is really what built them, right. They started as a blog, and then they created product second, and that's not something that I can say I've ever seen anywhere else, where someone started a super successful community as a blog as a written subject and then launched a product off of that glossier? I didn't know Yeah, as far as I know.
19:26
No, quote me but I, someone has another one.
19:31
Because I cannot think in my marketing
19:34
Yeah.
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Publication but if I'm wrong, like it's okay.
19:40
If I'm wrong, don't hate me. But as far as I am aware, this is one of the first times where product was not at the launch. It was pure community and communication and because that trust was already built. Product Launch was so easy and so viral right away, but community
20:00
He has always been at the core of this brand so I think getting away from that community getting away from the why they created this brand in the first place that I think as was the beginning of, of the tipping block, they're finding that why that why that makes you cry and why that makes you sparkle. So you know, this pivots us amazingly well into our next episode about finding a growth worth worthy niche in the internet space. So press that subscribe button, set your alarm for March 1 for another Sonia filled episode. And in the meantime, where can I be VIP? BFFs find you Sonia. Oh my gosh, I hope all of your BFFs find me because ever since I met you I knew that we were meant to be so if you love Harley, I know that we will get along and you can find me on the Instagram or the Tiktok at Sonia s o n i A dot Elise Ely s s and I drop lots of knowledge over there about influencer marketing, brand marketing, beauty biz, all types of fun stuff.
21:08
Thank you for listening to this episode of brand new creator if you loved it, rate review, subscribe and of course share. For more on how you can create influence and get paid. Come hang out with me on Instagram at Harley Jordan